Healer question

[Gmariam]

If someone where to arrive at St. Mungo's with no knowledge of how they were injured, how do you think the Healers would deal with it? This person has been gravely injured by very Dark magic but has no conscious memory of what happened.

Would the Healers have some sort of spell for retrieving the memory? Would they extract it and examine it in a Pensieve?

What if neither worked? What then?

Or would they respect the patient's privacy and not go into their mind, take out their memory? Would it seem improbable for them to treat the patient without figuring out what happened?

And do you see any way of the Healers not getting to the memory, but the patient being able to do so later on? The mind is a mysterious thing, after all...

Thanks!!
~Gina

[Vorona]

How dark are we talking? Because if it's something known (like the Cruciatus Curse), I'd imagine that Healers would have ways to diagnose the actual problem without needing specific memories, provided they know the spell in question. Only after ruling out everything they *can* diagnose would they worry about the situation you're describing.

And in that situation, I think since it is dark magic, they probably would look for memories, because if it's dark, it means there's a dark wizard out there who might do whatever it is again and again, and they'd want to be prepared for the next victim as well as having the knowledge to cure/help the current victim.

That's only a guess, though. It could also vary: perhaps there's a hospital rule not to intervene, but a particular Healer decides to do it anyway (probably a Gryffindor), or the opposite: a rule that they're supposed to do everything they can, but the Healer has had issues with memory invasion/privacy, so they choose not to. That could lead to some interesting conflict, if you want to bring the Healer into the forefront.

Edit: And, knowing Healers, they might actually have a specific type of Pensieve or other memory collection system that allows them to unerringly only pick the memories that are directly related to the current injury/trauma.

[lucca4]

I think they would treat the symptoms immediately. Perhaps if the outward physical trauma subsided or at least was under control, the patient would be able to remember more clearly what happened. They would probably have him/her under intensive care for a few days to make sure the patient wasn't going to relapse into whatever sort of state they were in before. I don't think the immediate approach would be to retrieve the memory, because there might be some possible repercussions, if the spell doesn't work wrong. No matter how powerful the witch/wizard is, mistakes do happen and I don't think they would want to take that chance if there were other options. There might also be an issue if the patient was an Unspeakable or highly-ranked Auror, where delving into their mind might release secrets...it might even be in their work contract that they aren't allowed to have memory spells done on them.

However, if the patient was severely catatonic, and they absolutely had no remedy to the present symptoms, I think the Healers would probably try retrieving a memory, if that was the only option left. I really don't think they would choose to do that if there were other methods that might work. But I don't think it's improbable for them to treat without knowing what happened; they just treat the symptoms, it's not always entirely necessary for them to know the background story.

And do you see any way of the Healers not getting to the memory, but the patient being able to do so later on? The mind is a mysterious thing, after all...

I can see that scenario happening: if the person was an Occlumens, for instance, and had guarded their mind against intruders, the Healers might not be able to reach it, but the person could probably do so after they were healed (even partially so). Maybe it was such a traumatic experience that the brain literally made the memory unaccessible, and once the patient healed mentally from the aftermath, the memory would be free again.

Hope this helps, and sorry for the horrid grammar .

xx Ariana xx

[Sapphire at Dawn]

Would it matter if the person couldn't remember or not? Wouldn't the healers just start treating at the symptoms and go from there? I mean, that's what our doctors do; someone who's come off a motorbike isn't going to say that he's got a punctured lung or severe internal bleeding, he's gonna say it hurts and he can't breathe well. It's up to the doctors to diagnose what's wrong, and I imagine it'd be the same for the healers. Like the bloke in OoTP who had the shoes who were eating his feet; I doubt he'd know the exact spell that was causing the shoes to do that, the healers would see the damage and either repair it, or guess what the spell was and reverse that.

But if you don't mean for diagnostics and mean just for general interest, or a Ministry enqiry, then perhaps there would be a way. Over here, the policy with possible sexual abuse or rape cases is that the healthcare professionals shouldn't ask questions about it; that should be left to the police who investigate. There could be some sort of policy like that in St Mungo's. It would also be a rather invasive thing to do, delve into someone's memory, and I don't mean physically invasive. Unless the patient has specifically asked that his or her memories be brought back, I don't think the healers would do it, or even want to do it. There's no mention of it being used on the woman who refused to tell the healers what bit her in OoTP.

I suppose the procedure in itself would be possible, after all, Dumbledore managed to find the real memory about the Riddle's murders from Morfin when it was hidden away. Virateserum could also be used. But the question really is, would the healers want to, does the patient want to, and what would it achieve?

Sarah x

[Gmariam]

Thanks for all the input, everyone! I absolutely agree that the Healers would start treating immediately. However, if they weren't making any progress, what then? You have made great arguments for Healers going in and finding the memory they need, as well as respecting a patient's privacy. Ariana, I love the idea of no mind-spells being written into someone's contract, especially since my character is an Auror.

Vorona, I had already written a bit with a Pensieve, which is sort of what prompted the question. The only thing was, it was the patient himself who went searching in the Pensieve for what happened to him. And so I wondered if the Healers would have done something like that first, or respected the patient's privacy before removing a memory, even for emergency treatment. I'm going to have to really hammer out my patient policy first to make it believable, I think.

Thanks for helping me sew up the plot holes! I love the discussion and ideas!
~Gina

[Equinox Chick]

Would the Healers necessarily have a Pensieve?

It was Dumbledore's invention, and isn't mentioned anywhere else in the books. I realise it's possible that he bequeathed it to St Mungo's or maybe produced others for their use, but he mainly uses it on himself to study his own thoughts. I'm not sure he'd have liked the idea of anyone being able to use one.

Just a random thought.

~Carole~

[Gmariam]

How do you know it was Dumbledore's invention? I had always thought it was rare, but not unique and original. I wrote a story where he found the Pensieve at Ollivander's, and actually gave it as a gift (which sadly came back to him.) I'm just curious, because I had thought about the Healers having one to look into, but that raises the question of violating the patient's privacy.
And of course, we know memories can be tampered with, so even if they took the patient's memory, who knows if it was really what happened to him? Basically, I want it to remain a mystery until I'm ready to reveal the secret, so I want to make sure no one says "Well, why didn't they do this?" to try to figure it out.
Thanks!
~Gina

[Equinox Chick]

Yes sorry, I'm wrong. I could have sworn there was something in GOF or OOTP where it was referred to as Dumbledore's invention. But I've just checked and that isn't the case. I think I'm confusing it with the Deluminator .


Now ... let's never speak of this again ...



~Carole - the - oh,so wrong ~

[Sapphire at Dawn]

However, if they weren't making any progress, what then?

Yes, I think if they'd exhausted all other options then they'd have to delve into the memory to see what it was. Perhaps the Aurors or someone would be on the hunt for the wand that comitted the crime to try and preform Prori Incantatem on it. I really think something as invasive as delving into someone's memory would really be left until last, and even then I think there would be tests to see if going inside their memory would be harmful to them. Breaking through memory charms could cause permenant damage, as in the case of Bertha Jorkins. The emphasis in healthcare is really to be as non-evasive as possible.

Sarah x