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Thread: Halfbreeds

  1. #21
    Inverarity
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    A couple of observations:

    (1) JKR has said that Teddy is not a werewolf, even though his father was one. So lycanthropy is apparently a magical curse, not a heritable condition.

    (2) We don't really know how vampirism works in Rowling's world. Since she tends to more or less follow traditional legends (usually), we can assume that vampires are, in fact, undead, and thus incapable of having children. But Rowling has never explicitly said that, so there isn't an official canon answer.

    (3) As a couple of others have noted, Rowling has said Flitwick has some goblin ancestry, which means goblins can interbreed with humans. Several people have suggested elf/goblin crossbreeds. I would suggest that this is even less likely than goblin/human. You're assuming that because they are similar in size, they might be more similar genetically, but from what we've seen of their traits, goblins would appear to be much closer to humans than either are to elves. Goblins and humans can both do magic only with wands or other tools, whereas elves seem to be innately magical beings. Elves appear to be much more alien, whereas goblins, while different from humans, have lifestyles and physical attributes that are much more recognizably human.

    (4) Remember that faeries, according to FB, are non-sentient creatures, little more than humanoid insects, not the ethereal, magical beings of legend. Ditto imps and pixies. So you'll have to make some other critters responsible for changelings if you want to introduce them in the Potterverse.

  2. #22
    Wizengamot Ravenclaw
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    Quote Originally Posted by Inverarity
    (4) Remember that faeries, according to FB, are non-sentient creatures, little more than humanoid insects, not the ethereal, magical beings of legend. Ditto imps and pixies. So you'll have to make some other critters responsible for changelings if you want to introduce them in the Potterverse.
    *plot bunny wheels turning* You know, I actually am working on a textbook style story for the site. The creature that actually does create changlings would be be a wonderful creature to write about. ThanX!

    Anyone else? Thoughts on changlings?

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  3. #23
    leahsm2
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    Quote Originally Posted by saizine
    [INDENT If the child was concieved and born before the transformation occured, then there is no possibility of them having vampirific traits (unless their parent bit them afterwards, but that doesn't seem like a good parenting choice ).
    Unfortunately, I would assume that Vampires would think that being a Vampire is a good thing, since you would no longer think or feel or process thoughts like some sad, pathetic, mortal being. I would think that making your child immortal would be seen as a good "Vamparitic" parenting choice. But I have no canon back up

  4. #24
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    Unfortunately, I would assume that Vampires would think that being a Vampire is a good thing, since you would no longer think or feel or process thoughts like some sad, pathetic, mortal being. I would think that making your child immortal would be seen as a good "Vamparitic" parenting choice. But I have no canon back up
    Wow, I'm getting all kinds of plot bunnies going in my head from this thread.

    Here's another little pondering I want to put forward:
    How would you say the opinion of halfbreed would have changed from Harry's generation to his children's? (Remember how Umbridge so throughly detested halfbreeds in the books?)

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  5. #25
    leahsm2
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    How would you say the opinion of halfbreed would have changed from Harry's generation to his children's? (Remember how Umbridge so throughly detested halfbreeds in the books?)

    Yes, but all right thinking people in the books (and reading them, one would hope!) saw right through her. I mean, she had poor, dead Mad Eye Moody's umm . . . "Mad Eye" nailed to her door at the Ministry? Minister for Magic Shacklebolt is portrayed as the breath of reason sweeping through the Ministry (Gee, could he have been a right thinking Slytherin, one has one's girlish hopes!)

    He knows right from wrong and does what he can! He was in charge of finding Sirius Black, I believe, but turned a blind eye, knowing full well where to find him, but believing in Black's innocence he sort of sand-bagged the search, because it was a hopelessy corrupt, small-minded system!

    Anyway, I think that the new regime was embarrassed by the hard-handed approach, and the narrow mindedness of it predessors and would have therefore abolished most of the "categories" which held other able-minded creatures ( and their mixed blood progeny) to a lower status.

    I have to admit, though that I feel bad for the Dementors in that they were only doing what it is they were "born" (umm . . . many interesting theories on their origin "what caused them to exist") to do, but they were pretty nasty, so only "this much" bad!

    This thread is so fun (if slightly politically incorrect!)

  6. #26
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    In regards to the possibility of lycanthropy passing to offspring, I can't decide if I agree that it can not. I have long thought that a werewolf would either be incapable of reproducing or that it would be possible that the curse could somehow pass on. I became even less sure that it could not pass on to children when it was said that Bill might show some signs, but would not be a full werewolf when he was attacked by Greyback on a normal day. If lycanthropy only activates during the full moon, then how could Greyback have passed anything off to Bill? Surely, it must be present in some form (genetic, bacterial???) for Bill to have any sort of infection. Also, Remus would surely know as much as anyone the specifics of his affliction and he is convinced that his unborn child will be like him. He does say that werewolves don't usually breed, giving me the impression that he really doesn't know one way or the other, but it is obviously a possibility that he is concerned about. Teddy turns out to be free of lycanthropy, but is that like parents who carry genetic defects that do not necessarily pass on to their children? I don't know. But I think JKR definitely left the possibility open. Also, if I remember correctly, Snape includes giving the "ways" one becomes a werewolf in his assignment to Harry's class doesn't he? That would suggest that being bitten isn't the only one. *will check PoA*

    I lean towards the idea that it could be passed on to one's offspring, but not necessarily must be. I also lean towards it being like an infection as opposed to genetic.

    edit: Thanks, mudbloodproud. I was wondering if I might be confusing movie for canon. I checked the book last night and discovered I must have. I just hate when that happens. >.< I still maintain the possibility for werewolves to pass on lycanthropy to their offspring was left open though, based on the Bill info and Remus' concern.

  7. #27
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    On the subject of vampires, on J.K's website, one of her wizards of the month was a man named Lorcan d'Eath, who was a singer and part-vampire.

    It is unclear in canon what it means to be a part vampire. Is he in the process of being cured? Did the vampirization process get interrupted somehow for him? JKR's Wizard of the Month for November 2006 (JKR).
    That's from the lexicon. I think the meaning of 'part vampire' might be entirely up to the writer - perhaps the process got interrupted, perhaps part vampires are born, not made or perhaps the write might use creative licence and come up with their own reason.



  8. #28
    saizine
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    I've been doing some other reading outside of the Harry Potter series and any counterparts of it on the web and instead turned to some RPG rulebooks (mainly Vampire: The Masquerade/Requirem and Werewolf: Apocalyspe) and they've unearthed some interesting points.

    Regarding werewolves: there seems to be two distinct seperate theories, one which is of the "moon werewolf" (one that changes once per month at the full, and is created through biting), and the other is a werewolf is born, not created. The latter is what I am more familiar with at this point, and the parentage must be of werewolf crossed with a human. If a werewolf breeds with a werewolf, then a terrible monster will be born. The offspring knows nothing about the curse until their "first change" around the age of thirteen and even then it takes a few nights/weeks to complete absolutely (with buildup and hints before the actual "transformation").

    Regarding vampires (and mainly parents-biting-children dynamic): Vampires have three rules of tradirtion; the Masquerade, Progeny, and Amaranth. The Masquerade contains rules on keeping vampires hidden from humans. Progeny refers to creating a "childe", which requires the permission of a clan elder and has dire consequences if a transformation occurs without permission. If a childe is sired then the sire must teach it the ways of the Masquerade and stay with it for the duration of the first few painful nights. Amaranth forbids vampires from drinking the blood of other vampires.

    Just a bit more information to throw out there, and another view on the myths and views on whether Teddy could have inherited his father's lycanthropy (however, it seems that JKR used the "moon werewolf" version and not the "a werewolf in born not created". so I'm not sure that applies to Harry Potter as a series).

    xoxo Lessie

  9. #29
    Inverarity
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    Quote Originally Posted by saizine
    Just a bit more information to throw out there, and another view on the myths and views on whether Teddy could have inherited his father's lycanthropy (however, it seems that JKR used the "moon werewolf" version and not the "a werewolf in born not created". so I'm not sure that applies to Harry Potter as a series).
    I don't think it does at all. The V:tM and W:tA RPGs made up their own cosmologies and "rules" for werewolves and vampires, only loosely based on actual myth and legend. (V:tM was more heavily influenced by Anne Rice than anything else, and Anne Rice definitely made stuff up about vampires with little or no basis in legend.)

    Even if you go back to the "original" vampire story, Bram Stoker's Dracula, he stitched together a lot of myths to create a new story and pretty much invented the modern vampire genre. Rowling seems to base her vampires largely on the modern view of them (and most of the vampires on her site were parodies anyway).

    But I wouldn't take things like the Masquerade as being applicable to Harry Potter, unless you really want to do a HP/World of Darkness crossover.

    Likewise werewolves. There is very little in myth specifying the breeding habits of werewolves, what will happen if a werewolf breeds with a human, as opposed to another werewolf, etc. But Remus Lupin and Fenrir Greyback (the only werewolves we meet in canon) both appear to follow the "magical curse/moon werewolf" model. They're normal people (well, an insane sociopath in Greyback's case, but still human) except during the full moon. Since Remus fathers a child, obviously werewolves are essentially human when not in wolf form.

  10. #30
    leahsm2
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    I think if you think of the effects of Polyjuice Potion, you get a better feel of lycanthropy, as even if you were to pass on your genes under the disguise of Polyjuice, they would still be your genes, unaltered. JK did say specifically that werewolves don't have "cubs", BTY.

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