Harry Potter

[Blossomlily]

I don't know if this question has been asked or not, but do you think there is any way in the world that Harry could turn over to the other side? I know he has high moral standards, but would he do it if he thought he was saving someone by switching, or are those morals too high to allow that?

Harry appears steadfast to me.He would never intentionally give himself over to the dark side. His horror after performing 'sectumsempra' shows that. He might pretend to go over, act, plot, whatever , to deceive outsiders' eyes, but I'm afraid I don't see his morals shifting even to save someone, say Ginny. He has suffered a lot due to the other side - lost his parents, his godfather, so many close people. He has endured sadness, guilt, loneliness, lack of love because of them. There seems to be no reason for Harry to get a political tint in his character all of a sudden.

Does anyone think that Harry might have the ability to sing? In a fic I'm working on I have him being musically gifted along with his family on his mother's side. Is it OOC or is it a possibility?

I'm afraid I have to agree with Anna - it does sound OOC to me because Harry doesn't seem to me the type to intentionally display his singing abilities. He seems to be awkward just while speaking in public - during the first DA meeting, for instance.

The idea of handing him a completely new musical instrument and telling him his mother played on it sounds good, however, because I believe that though he might have inherited Lily's voice, he needn't necessarily have the inclination to sing. Right from childhood, he's been shunned, and I don't think such children could ever 'inherit' natural talents. It would have been a different story if Lily had been alive and Harry had got to listen to her singing right from childhood.

You might, however, have him sing in private, I think... because even people with the worst of voices (*coughmecough*) get away with bathroom singing..

[Periwinkle]

That's an interesting question!

What do you mean by joining the Dark Side? If Harry is forced to become a Death Eater, then no. He wouldn't join the Dark Side if he had to become a Death Eater -- [for example] even if any of his friends were threatened. He'd seek help from the Order and the Order would try to win that friend back without Harry becoming a DE.

However, if Harry isn't asked to become a Death Eater, but just be an ally of the Dark Lord, and a friend is in danger, he might if the situation is dire. He'll believe he can work something out in order to save the friend. But if he's sure or has some hope that that friend can be saved without him joining the ranks of Voldemort, he wouldn't go ahead with the decision. Harry has high morals, you're right. He would be very vehement otherwise if asked/forced to join the Dark Side. He'd rather die than join the Dark Side but if there's a huge drawback i.e. Hermione being killed then he would most likely join the Dark Side. He wouldn't participate in any of the activities: killing, robbing etc. If Harry is to join the Dark Side, he would do so with the intention of getting that friend to safety and immediately leaving.

Which brings up some rather pertinent problems. Would Harry have to sign/take an oath? Most likely. Voldemort would use Occlumency to see Harry's thoughts, so Harry would have to be skilled in that department. There are many more problems like these. So, when taking this to mind, I recommend you evaluate the situation and ask yourself how much time you're willing to put into the matter and form your own opinions.

My two cents.

[Gryffinpuff]

I don't know if this question has been asked or not, but do you think there is any way in the world that Harry could turn over to the other side? I know he has high moral standards, but would he do it if he thought he was saving someone by switching, or are those morals too high to allow that?

Without getting too Star Wars, Darth Vaderish, I do believe Harry will probably stumble "into the dark side" for a small portion of Book 7. By small I mean even infintesimal amount of time, a few brief seconds, but yes, he will.

If you look at archetypal standards, the hero must be tempted as some point to join evil. Harry has been tempted numerous times. Book 1 Voldemort offers to make Harry "great" if he gives him the stone. In OotP when his mind is consumed with Voldemort, he fears he's crossing into that realm. In CoS he wonders if he's Slytherins heir and somehow unknowingly attacking the students. And, of course, in HBP you have the Sectumsempra, though Harry didn't know what it would do until afterwards.

But, there is actually a second moment in HBP that seems more important to me. Harry tries to use Unforgivable Curses on Snape. Even after knowing what it's like to be tortured, and seeing what can happen to people when using dark spells, he willing tried to employ one. Snapes reply of, "No Unforgivables for you, Potter," is foreshadowing something. I think Harry is going to fall victim to his anger, his rash actions, and hurt/kill someone in his quest to defeat Voldemort. He will, therefore, cross over to "the dark side" for a brief time.

But, this series has a major theme of redemption. Harry will come back, perhaps after an emotional battle with himself, and will start fighting with love, just like Dumbledore suggested. It will be a brief stint of darkness, but he in no way would permanently join up with the likes of Voldemort.

[nysuperstarz]

I don't know if this question has been asked or not, but do you think there is any way in the world that Harry could turn over to the other side? I know he has high moral standards, but would he do it if he thought he was saving someone by switching, or are those morals too high to allow that?

Personally, I don't think that after all he's been through he would go to the dark side. Maybe in the beginning of his Hogwarts days, before he learned more about the past and his parents there would definatly have been a chance. Like Dumbledore said in one of the books (5th or 6th can't remember, will check and edit later) it is a miralce that Harry hasn't been atracted to the dark side, and that he's been through sooo much that it would have natually propelled anyone to take intrest, but Harry was diiferent (somthing like that).

The power the dark lord knows not can be inferred to be love and thats what I believe kept him from going to the dark side and will keep him away. He loves his parents, Sirius, and Dumbledore and doesn't want thier sacrafices to go in vain. he knows that there lives were taken be the dark side and his love for them will keep him away from the dark side.

I think if the situation persented itself and sombody very close to Harry could be saved if he converted to the dark side. I still think he wouldn't do it but would find another way to save them, I mean they are never short on ideas are they?

[jpkitty]

I don't know if this question has been asked or not, but do you think there is any way in the world that Harry could turn over to the other side? I know he has high moral standards, but would he do it if he thought he was saving someone by switching, or are those morals too high to allow that?

I don't think so. If Harry joined the Death Eaters he'd basically be commiting suicide. I think if he had to save someone, he'd find another way to do it. Voldemort's not stupid, he wouldn't let someone that had opposed him and lived four times live, even if he offered his services. I think he's more likely do all he could to save the person than turn to the Death Eaters.

[Gmariam]

But, there is actually a second moment in HBP that seems more important to me. Harry tries to use Unforgivable Curses on Snape. Even after knowing what it's like to be tortured, and seeing what can happen to people when using dark spells, he willing tried to employ one. Snapes reply of, "No Unforgivables for you, Potter," is foreshadowing something. I think Harry is going to fall victim to his anger, his rash actions, and hurt/kill someone in his quest to defeat Voldemort. He will, therefore, cross over to "the dark side" for a brief time.

I agree with this - I even wrote an editorial that addressed it a bit. A lot of people think Harry is too pure, too good, too full of love to give in to any anger or hate and turn to the "Dark side." Dumbledore himself points out how Harry has never been tempted by Dark magic, in spite of all he's been through. And certainly, I think its possible that Harry will remain this way through Book Seven. The best evidence for this is Harry's reaction at the end of Book Six: he is strong, resolute, determined. As a reader, I was not left with the impression that Harry was going to have another summer of nightmares and anger, like he did after Cedric died; or another summer of laying around depressed, like after Sirius died. It seems to me that JKR has set the stage for Harry to be very focused and strong in Book Seven.

Now, that said - a lot of other things could happen. Perhaps he goes back to the Dursleys and relapses, finding himself unable to deal with the pain and the horrible burden he believes he must carry alone. Perhaps Harry bottles in so much that he explodes halfway through the last book. Perhaps a terrible event will shake his confidence early on. So I think it's possible that we may see angry!Harry or angsty!Harry again in Book Seven in spite of how he was presented at the end of Book Six. If JKR writes him that way, she will write it so its right for him to be that way: it will make perfect sense no matter what theories we've come to believe in the meantime.

I think the most likely scenario for Harry to "cross the line" so to speak would be a sudden, violent outburst. No matter what happens, I can't see Harry deliberately plotting to use Dark magic (and I don't see him starting off Book Seven in a funk, I think he will at least start off strong.) I think it more likely that in a moment of unbearable pain and loss Harry might finally snap and lash out, harder than he has yet. Again - some people think Harry is not capable of this whatsoever, or that he has matured past this possibility. But I think its still on the table. Imagine how gut wrenching it would be. Imagine the dramatic repercussions. Harry would immediately regret his actions, and would now carry the added burden of guilt on his already heavy shoulders. He might begin to doubt himself; he might distance himself. It would be devastating. <sniff>

But any brief turn won't last - Harry is wise enough to realize the wrongness of it, and the futility. And frankly, I think he is strong enough to pick himself up - after a brief pity party, of course - dust himself off and be the stronger for it.

But, this series has a major theme of redemption. Harry will come back, perhaps after an emotional battle with himself, and will start fighting with love, just like Dumbledore suggested. It will be a brief stint of darkness, but he in no way would permanently join up with the likes of Voldemort.

Absolutely. I also think that the redemption theme may play out in a major way, and JKR has sort of hinted at it. Grace is defined at Merriam Webster Online as "unmerited divine assistance given humans for their regeneration or sanctification." I think Harry will achieve a state of grace, and be granted this divine assistance. I think it will be in the form of unlooked for help at a critical moment. It could even be at the moment where he snaps - perhaps this unlooked for help snaps him back.

I know there is no "God" in the HP universe to send down this "divine assistance" but that doesn't mean it can't happen and that readers aren't allowed to interpret it whatever way is closest to their spiritual inclinations. Some people probably won't even notice. But here's one of those parallels to other stories that I know drive people crazy; I apologize ahead of time but I am still struck by its validity and its possible influence on the finale of Book Seven. In The Lord of the Rings, Frodo actually *failed* his quest to destroy the One Ring. But at the end, he was given that divine assistance, grace, when Gollum not only bit the Ring from his finger but started dancing around, to the point that he fell into the Crack of Doom and destroyed the Ring - he accomplished what Frodo could not.

So I really do think its possible something like this will happen - Harry may be on the brink of failure, or crossing that line, when unlooked for help tips the scales back in Harry's favor. In my editorial, I speculated that this help would come from Snape, but it may also come from Wormtongue. It could even come from a sacrifice that one of the *good* guys makes. Again - it would be devastating.

To play devils advocate with myself - perhaps this will be the time when Harry finally stands truly by himself, with no one to help him in any way, and everything I've just written is bunk. But I really do think Harry has earned his saving grace, so I'm not going to argue too hard with myself. JKR has written too much about love and friendship and compassion to strand Harry alone at the end: love and friendship and compassion - and grace - will sustain him and win him through.

<whew> That got a bit heavy, didn't it? If you are still with me, I appreciate it! If you'd like to read the editorial I referenced, feel free to PM me. Enjoy the continued discussion!

~Gina

[SiriuslyMental]

In an AU story I'm writing, Harry finds out he is Snape's son, and, because the Ministry of Magic is becoming dangerously aggressive in their attempts to gain custody of him, must go under the disguise of Snape's apprentice.

What I'm wondering is, would Harry (under disguise) laugh at a joke that makes fun of Mudbloods? Or would he sit there and kind of shift uncomfortably and try to change the subject or something?

I can PM an excerpt, if it helps to explain what I mean.

[Sly Severus]

I don't think Harry would really be able to laugh at such a joke, under any circumstances. He feels very strongly about this. His mother was Muggleborn, and so was one of his best friends. I don't think he would be able to set his feelings aside and pretend that he finds that amusing.

In COS, when Harry and Ron used Polyjuice Potion to question Draco about the Heir of Slytherin, Draco was making fun of Arthur Weasley and the best Harry could manage was:

COS, Canadian Edition, pg.166
"Ha, ha," said Harry bleakly.

I don't think he would do any better now. I think if Harry was expected to poke fun at Muggleborn wizards he would fail. I very much doubt he would have the self control to fool anyone who would be talking to Snape about Muggbleborns.

[nysuperstarz]

In an AU story I'm writing, Harry finds out he is Snape's son, and, because the Ministry of Magic is becoming dangerously aggressive in their attempts to gain custody of him, must go under the disguise of Snape's apprentice.

What I'm wondering is, would Harry (under disguise) laugh at a joke that makes fun of Mudbloods? Or would he sit there and kind of shift uncomfortably and try to change the subject or something?

I can PM an excerpt, if it helps to explain what I mean.

I think an excerpt would be nice, but I dont think he would laugh, maybe a uncomfortably a bit but nothing big. I agree with Sly Severus, Harry is known to have a temper but I dont exactly think he would explode, I think the shifting uncomfortably is your best shot!

[SiriuslyMental]

In that vein, would Harry, after being under an insane amount of pressure, having Ron insulting him in Grimmauld Place, cornered by the Weasleys, concerned because Kreacher knows who he really is, curious about what's going on in the OotP meeting just a door away, and thoroughly frustrated with his friends being arses to him (although they don't know who he really is), call Hermione a Mudblood OR insult the Weasley family's lack of money? I was leading toward the Weasley one, simply because Ron's being the major arse, and Hermione hasn't bothered him nearly as much. And it seemed to me like it would be easier for him to comment on that, over something blood related. What do you think?

One has to happen because it ties in with the plot, but I'm really having trouble with it.