Sirius Black

[Vault713]

I"m sorry if this is already somewhere on this thread.

When Sirius was in school did he play Quidditch and if so what position? I've read some stories where he was beater, but I'm not sure if that's canon or just authors choice.

It seems to me that playing Quidditch would fit with the big man on campus feel and we know his best friend James played. I just wanted to know if there is anything in books or interviews that verify that. Please help!

[fg_weasley]

When Sirius was in school did he play Quidditch and if so what position? I've read some stories where he was beater, but I'm not sure if that's canon or just authors choice.

It seems to me that playing Quidditch would fit with the big man on campus feel and we know his best friend James played. I just wanted to know if there is anything in books or interviews that verify that. Please help!

There's no canon evidence, that I am aware of, that Sirius played Quidditch with James, and personally, I think it would have been something he would have mentioned to Harry if that were the case. He did give Harry a broom for his first birthday, so I would guess he cared about the game and probably valued it from the sidelines, but I doubt he actually played himself. There's no mention of it in sources outside the books, either.

In any case, him being a Beater is definitely a [albeit very popular] fanon manifestation - though, admittedly, if he had played, Beater would have been a good position for him. In my opinion, though, Sirius wouldn't have been disciplined enough to play on the Quidditch team, nor would he really enjoy the rigidity. Also, the best evidence against this, I think and as far as is personality goes, is that Sirius gets bored of things easily and, even if he did start out playing with James, he probably didn't stick with it very long.

I hope that helps.

Bine: 1 point from Hufflepuff for not following formatting rules. Since you've been advised of the rules several times, the next time it's going to be five points.

[Sapphire at Dawn]

This question has been asked before, but that was ages ago. What do people think Sirius's Patronus would have been? I'm leaning towards a dog, but is that too cliche? Is there something that would fit him better? I know it's the same as his Animagus form, but McGonagall's is the same. I'm just wanting a few thoughts before I decide anything concrete.

Sarah x

[Karaley Dargen]

I always thought Sirius had a lion-ish Patronus. It's the symbol of Gryffindor, and that's where his friends are and that's what makes him feel safe. I don't know if Patronus and Animagus forms usually are the same... but if you want to make it something other than a dog, you could think about where he feels protected. When he can't stand his parents/family anymore, he turns to his friends... you could have something wolfish/doggish if you want him perhaps to mirror Remus... But I think Sirius really feels safest among his friends, and that's in Gryffindor. That's of course only my opinion. I can imagine his Patronus changing too after the betrayal... But to what, no idea. For some reason I'm thinking of some sort of bird, but there's no rational thought behind that.

[Equinox Chick]

I'd like some ideas about this too. Unfortunately - for all the reasons Kara has just used - I've assigned the Gryffindor Lion to Remus (happiest at Hogwarts, protected by Gryffindor - etc etc).

I was veering towards something doggish because I think Sirius was pretty confident in his own ability to protect himself (James and McG both have the same Patronus and Animagus form)

Post-James' death? Can he rely on himself? He clearly can't trust his own judgement (preferring Peter to Remus), so maybe it would be a manifestation of James in some form.

Carole

[Virgil]

I was under the impression that one's Patronus was always the same as his or her Animagus form. I always just figured that Sirius's Patronus would be a shaggy dog. Also, Sirius's attributes correlate to that of a dog - fiercely loyal, but also a wild streak. His strong sense of honor might lend itself to the lion, but I just don't personally like the idea of a character having a Patronus that is the same as the symbol of one of the founders. It's like saying that they were equals, and I've always thought of Godric Gryffindor as this god-like person. Sirius has faults, especially when it comes to revenge (wanting to kill Peter Pettigrew ASAP), which is something more commonly associated with Slytherin (he is a Black, after all).

I digress.

As for changing after James's death, I doubt that would happen. They were best friends, but Sirius wasn't tragically in love with him (well, I suppose in AU fanfiction, anything is possible). The only examples of a mutating Patronus we see in the books are Snape/Lily with Snape's changing into a doe, which makes sense because he actually was a bit obsessed with Lily in a hopelessly romantic sort of way; and Tonks/Lupin, which was also a circumstance of [somewhat] unrequited love.

but is that too cliche?

In my personal opinion, it's not cliche at all. J.K. Rowling named this character after the Dog Star. It's quite obvious that she, as the author, wanted people to make this connection. It only makes sense to me that Sirius's Patronus would be a dog.

Virgil

[Karaley Dargen]

I was under the impression that one's Patronus was always the same as his or her Animagus form. I always just figured that Sirius's Patronus would be a shaggy dog. Also, Sirius's attributes correlate to that of a dog - fiercely loyal, but also a wild streak. His strong sense of honor might lend itself to the lion, but I just don't personally like the idea of a character having a Patronus that is the same as the symbol of one of the founders. It's like saying that they were equals, and I've always thought of Godric Gryffindor as this god-like person. Sirius has faults, especially when it comes to revenge (wanting to kill Peter Pettigrew ASAP), which is something more commonly associated with Slytherin (he is a Black, after all).

The thing is though - the animagus represents your personality. I agree that having Sirius' Animagus form that of a lion (or anyone else have the Animagus form of one of the house animals) would be sort of Gary-Stu-Territory. However, the Patronus represents what you feel protects you, not who you are. And I think Sirius would feel protected by his school/house.

As for changing after James's death, I doubt that would happen. They were best friends, but Sirius wasn't tragically in love with him (well, I suppose in AU fanfiction, anything is possible). The only examples of a mutating Patronus we see in the books are Snape/Lily with Snape's changing into a doe, which makes sense because he actually was a bit obsessed with Lily in a hopelessly romantic sort of way; and Tonks/Lupin, which was also a circumstance of [somewhat] unrequited love.

But only because you're not in love with someone doesn't mean that you can't have very strong emotions for/towards/about that person. They were so much like brothers... It sounds like they spent a lot of time at school together, and then Sirius actually lived with James and his parents - I think to Sirius, James was much more of a brother than Regulus (after they both went to Hogwarts) ever had been. It was James who took Sirius in when he couldn't go back to his own family anymore. It's stressed so often in the books how close the two of them were.

And then of course it's not only the loss of James and Lily that would make him change. It's also that one of his other friends who he trusted so much (and more than Remus at the time), one of the few people he thought would never turn on them betrayed him and James and Lily. His whole world is falling apart at that point. And then he's sent to Azkaban, where anyone else would have gone completely insane... I think there are plenty of reasons why his Animagus would change in that time. His Gryffindor band of friends is falling apart, his brother-like friend and his dear wife are dead.. And on top of it all, Sirius thinks it's all his own fault.

I mean, maybe he wasn't even able to produce a Patronus after Azkaban... I dunno. Do we have proof either way? I think he probably would have struggled at least for a while, but then he did have a lot of good memories to feed the Patronus with. I think whether his Patronus changes depends on what it was before. Like - if it had something to do with Peter, it probably would change because now Sirius knows that Peter betrayed everyone.

[Virgil]

I mean, maybe he wasn't even able to produce a Patronus after Azkaban...

That's a really, really good point. You need a powerful, happy memory into order to be able to produce a Patronus. A traumatic experience like rooming with dementors with twelve years could very possibly damage or extinguish one's ability to do the spell properly. It's very possible that Sirius's Patronus, if he was able to make one at all, would have no form and simply be a white disk like Harry's was when he was a beginner.

Well, I suppose unless somebody directly asks Madame Rowling, we'll never know for sure.

Virgil

[Equinox Chick]

I mean, maybe he wasn't even able to produce a Patronus after Azkaban... I dunno.

*sighs as Kara has just pre-empted one of my plots*

Regarding Animagus/Patronus forms. We have very little evidence, because the only Animagus we see cast a Patronus is McGonagall. James, we're told by Harry (and JKR later) had the same for both.

However what leads me to believe that the Animagus and Patronus forms are not always the same is that the Patronus can change. Tonks' changes from something to a wolf (her representation of Remus who she loves and thinks of as her protector). At first I thought her Patronus could change because she's a Metamorphmagus, but Remus says anyone's can change.

I'm also thinking that Snape's Animagus form wouldn't have been a doe ... it's nothing like his personality.

Okay, some more questions about the lovely Mr Black.

He leaves home at 16 and stays with the Potters. When he comes of age he inherits some money from his Uncle Alphard. What do you think he does for money in the meantime?

I think he'd feel very uncomfortable taking money off the Potters - do you agree?

So he needs to earn money. I have one or two ideas for my story, but I'd like some wacky as well as decent suggestions for Padfoot to consider. (legal? illegal? Up to you)

~Carole~

[A.H.]

I think he'd feel very uncomfortable taking money off the Potters - do you agree?

I do. I think he would do all he could to make up for it -- helping then with dinner, dishes, cleaning, fixing things, yard work. He would probably go out of his way to pull his weight around the house, and maybe volunteer to do extra things for them, like... building... things? I don't know.

In one story, long abandoned, I imagined Mrs Potter being extremely angry with Sirius' parents and writing a flurry of angry letters, ending with a visit, until they made an honest effort to help their son at least financially. I think James got his endless perseverance from somewhere, and Mrs Potter forcing the Blacks to cough up gold for at least his education (school supplies) seems likely, to me. We know the Potters were financially well off, but I imagined it being the principal of the thing.

Whether Sirius would have wanted that or not -- well I don't think he would have. But I don't see that as deterrent to an angry mother.

So he needs to earn money. I have one or two ideas for my story, but I'd like some wacky as well as decent suggestions for Padfoot to consider. (legal? illegal? Up to you)

Maybe he would have worked at a bar (muggle or magical) during the summer? At sixteen it's unlikely the Potters would have allowed it, but there's always sneaking out. (And dozens of ways a young wizard could trick a muggle barkeep.) Working among crowds of drunk muggles also opens up possibilities... maybe he would have sold innocuous-looking magical paraphernalia, reminiscent of one Fred and one George Weasley. But he's broke, so where would he get the items in the first place? Right, I'm not too creative.

I don't think that was too helpful.

Edit: I suggest a bar, rather than shop or restaurant, because a night job just seems more likely to me (although I don't know what night life is like in England -- are there restaurants and the like open?).

Oh -- well if he flies in your story, he could opt to tutor younger children. Maybe James already does this as a summer job, and Sirius jumps on board? If you want it humorous, he could have no talent flying. "Lean forward! Atta boy! Keep going, that tree is yards off -- slow down?! HOW WOULD I KNOW HOW TO SLOW THE THING! ABANDON BROOM, ABANDON BROOM!" xD Sorry.