Voldemort

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Originally Posted by red and gold

I definitely agree with Hanni- I think your excerpt sounds great!



Hmmm. I guess it would depend on whether Snape was already being used by Voldy during the Marauder era. Perhaps Voldy tries to convert Lily, eventually fails for some reason and then he seeks out Snape and his Potions skills in order to replace her?

I think that's a good point about Lily being good at charms - Ollivander says her wand was perfect for Charms work. And there are some good charms that can be used in a dark fashion - such as "Scourgify". Maybe Lily could teach those to the Death Eaters - broaden their repertoire a bit.

I personally see Voldy needing a really good Potions person, though, because potions are so fiddly and needing precise timing and exact amounts of ingredients. It's not something to be trusted to just anyone, I don't think, and many of the Dark Lord's Death Eaters don't strike me as the patient type who mind sitting around for several weeks keeping a close eye on the Polyjuice Potion. :p Hee, hee!

Please let me know how your story turns out!
~Andrea

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I'm just not so sure that Lily really was so good at potions. Slughorn doesn't strike me as the most honest character, and he'd say pretty much anything to get on Harry's good side. That being said, I think she may have been good, but no where near Severus' level.

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There is just one thing that bothers me; Voldemort was said to have been very good at school. He had the top grades in everything. I just don't see why he would need help. One more thing; I feel as if Voldemort asking for any kind of help is a bit ooc. Death Eaters don't help him, they work for him. I think its even more ooc that he asking help from a muggle-born like Lily.

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That is easily solved. Simply make it a charm that the user can't cast himself, and don't have him ask Lily, have him demand it.

I disagree about Slughorn making it up to tell Harry. Yes, I do think he's trying to manipulate Harry, but he made a comment to Snape about how Lily was even better than he was and Snape didn't say anything. Which means he probably showed Lily favor when they were in school together (i.e. *before* needing to manipulate Harry). And he does seem surprised when Muggleborns do as well as Purebloods, even if he pretends he doesn't have a prejudice. So, I really doubt he would favor her, a Muggleborn, without her showing a lot of talent. And if he didn't favor her while they were in school, I really think Snape would have said something like, "Funny, I don't remember that being your opinion when we were actually in class together." I don't think he'd have let it slide.

Now, whether she was better or worse than Snape is another issue, since Slughorn does have *personal* reasons for not liking people (i.e. Draco), and I think prefers *popular* people. Snape may have had a "gang of Slytherins" he hung out with, but I doubt he was ever popular. Nor does he seem to have a lot of charisma or charm, which I think would also appeal to Slughorn. So, Snape might still be better than Lily at Potions, but Slughorn wouldn't admit it because Lily is a lot more appealing (and she *was* popular).

That said, I can see Voldemort trying to get more than one person to help with Potions. He wouldn't want to do it all himself, even if he could, because he probably wouldn't have time, especially for any of the tedious details. Having only one person means you have to rely on them in a certain sense, but if he has two, one of them could replace the other. In other words, I think his lack of trust would make it so that he had two helpers and not just one, so that if one ended up being a traitor, he wouldn't lose his only Potions-maker.

This was a long way of saying that I think it works, but you might want to include some of that in your background so people don't think, "Wait, what about Snape?"

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Now, whether she was better or worse than Snape is another issue, since Slughorn does have *personal* reasons for not liking people (i.e. Draco), and I think prefers *popular* people. Snape may have had a "gang of Slytherins" he hung out with, but I doubt he was ever popular. Nor does he seem to have a lot of charisma or charm, which I think would also appeal to Slughorn. So, Snape might still be better than Lily at Potions, but Slughorn wouldn't admit it because Lily is a lot more appealing (and she *was* popular).

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And this is exactly why I think that Lily was not as good as Severus, yet Slughorn still thinks so. Severus as a child probably didn't look like he would be going anywhere important in life, so he wasn't a real interest to Slughorn. Lily, quite obviously, is very outgoing so, as you said, would catch Slughorns eye. I think she did have some talent, but by no means at Snape's level, when he is making changes to his potion. I can even see him sharing his information with her, if they were friends, thus making her seem even more talented, but that of course is debatable.

But this is for another thread.

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That said, I can see Voldemort trying to get more than one person to help with Potions. He wouldn't want to do it all himself, even if he could, because he probably wouldn't have time, especially for any of the tedious details. Having only one person means you have to rely on them in a certain sense, but if he has two, one of them could replace the other. In other words, I think his lack of trust would make it so that he had two helpers and not just one, so that if one ended up being a traitor, he wouldn't lose his only Potions-maker.

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That is true, I completly agree.

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Now, whether she was better or worse than Snape is another issue, since Slughorn does have *personal* reasons for not liking people (i.e. Draco), and I think prefers *popular* people. Snape may have had a "gang of Slytherins" he hung out with, but I doubt he was ever popular. Nor does he seem to have a lot of charisma or charm, which I think would also appeal to Slughorn. So, Snape might still be better than Lily at Potions, but Slughorn wouldn't admit it because Lily is a lot more appealing (and she *was* popular).

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If I were Voldemort and I was choosing between Snape and Lily, I wouldn't think twice. Snape - ugly and unpopular. Lily - extremly pretty and popular. If you are still intending to use the part of the first extract where he wanted... something else in your story, than I could especially understand why Lily would be first choice. Pretty, intelligent and useful in... a few ways, she would be way preferable to some ugly boy who would have only one purpose.

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...is he just using her to get to someone?

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Well, Lily and James both defy Voldemort three times. So maybe James did something, brought himself to Voldemort's attention (really bad idea), and Voldemort learned that James had a pretty, talented girlfriend who was exceptional at both Potions and Charms. Between the prettiness, the talent, and the possible harm that could be brought to James, she would have been a tempting target.

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I really think a way like that might work better with a noble, brave woman like Lily. She threw herself in front of a Death Curse to protect her child. She is not one to take well to death threats and Voldemort would find out soon enough that she is not to be coerced in that manner.

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No kidding. I almost feel sorry for him...almost. But I do think that, if he uses James's life as blackmail, she will do whatever he wants.

If you are making this into a Voldy/Lily, then I just want to let you know that you have a great start already!

~Kathy

Although I have nothing to add to the discussion at hand.
I do wanted to make a comment on Voldemorts skills in magic.

It struck me that Voldemort can't conjure a patronus.
I realised this when I was thinking about the memories Harry needed to conjure his full patronus. Those were happy memories, but to be more specific, it were the memories where he felt love.
Voldemort doesn't know love. Not at all. You might think he uses a memory when he obtains a rare artifact, but there is only greed in those memories, not love.
What do you think of this?

Voldemort, most likely, can't create a patronus, but we know from Severus that there is more than one way to defeat Dementors, even though Harry feels there is only one way.

That being said, does the memory have to be about love? We know that Harry is full of it, but Voldemort is not. Could he instead use one about greed, because that is what he is full of and what makes him happy?

Personally, I don't think so, but for the purpose of fanfiction it is something I wanted to throw out there.

That's the way I'm taking my one-shot.

Well, we can't think in ways of love for Voldemort. So maybe the feeling he had when he created the first Horcrux? Or when he killed his father?

--Hanni

I'm writing a comedy about the secret life of Voldemort, and it got rejected for OOCness, even though that's kind of the point. Any suggestions for making him more evil without destroying the humor element?

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Originally Posted by Flobberworm93

I'm writing a comedy about the secret life of Voldemort, and it got rejected for OOCness, even though that's kind of the point. Any suggestions for making him more evil without destroying the humor element?

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You could always have him torture people ... in unusual ways. For example, his victim could be forced to listen to a traditional Voldemort-rant until they can't take it anymore and they die from the extreme boredom of it all. Or he could force them to watch mind-numbing infomercials until they snapped. The sky's the limit! :)
Hopefully that gave you an idea!

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Originally Posted by Amber0_o

Well, the only problem with having her work on Potions that I see is that he already has Severus. I don't see why he would need another worker. *shrugs*

However, she was supposed to be good at charms, so that might help. Perhaps he wanted her to do a charm that would help him on his way toward immortality?

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What if Lily dabbled in Alchemy, like Nicholas Flamel? Considering how good she was with charm works and potions, may stand to reason that she could have been a good Alchemist. This may have caught Voldemort's attention, since he was on this quest for immortality. He might have figured he could use Lily to make his one Stone.

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Originally Posted by Amber0_o

That being said, does the memory have to be about love? We know that Harry is full of it, but Voldemort is not. Could he instead use one about greed, because that is what he is full of and what makes him happy?

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No, not love in the pure sense of what the word is.
Happiness is what you make of it. Just like beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

Remember in OOTP when Harry was getting little mind taps into Voldemort's psyche. Harry could sense that he was happy about something. All the while Volemort was getting closer and closer to what he wanted in the Dept. of Mysteries.